(bind tightly/sexual bondage debate/discussion)
What happens when you get four (for want of better terminology) rope tops together and ask them to deliberate their views on kinbaku?
As I’ve discovered during two decades of dealing with the Japanese in business, it’s not always the easiest of tasks discovering what they really think and even harder to get them to make bold statements. Their honorific culture makes it awkward for them to say anything negative and as I’ve had to learn the hard way, if they don’t say yes, then they probably mean no.
One trick I’ve acquired in all these years is that when I want to know what their views are on a given topic, I’ve found the best way is to put several of them together, pop a question and listen intently to what’s being said between them. You often get more than you bargained for.
So the stage was set behind closed doors at Bar –UBU–, Shinjuku among three friends and this accepted foreign interloper: Ero Ouji, Shigonawabingo san and Tessin Doyama san, with myself as the guest, complimented by Ugo san of SMpedia and the SM author Yuki Sakurai san assisting with their superb translation skills.
When I began by opening with the question on their histories they were somewhat dismissive; “Everything you need to know is already written in places such as SMpedia, etc.” they said, not wanting to cover old ground.
So we moved on rapidly to the question on how they felt about gaijin misunderstanding of kinbaku and shibari, and how they would describe the two terms?
Ouji: Well, there are different types of bondage overseas and regarding rope techniques, etc. we Japanese also copy foreigners. Gaijin seem to think of kinbaku as a dō (the ‘dojo’ martial art mentality), like jūdō or kyūdō and even try to learn its shosa. This in itself is not a bad thing. In fact, I think Steve also teaches shosa. That’s why we think what non–Japanese are doing is kinbaku–dō. For example, in the case of jūdō, not learning techiques for just throwing someone no matter whether it is rude or not, but starting with a bow and ending with a bow as a mark of respect. Gaijin (foreigners) who consider kinbaku a dō copy something they think is Japanese because they like that idea the most. However, being aware of gaijin interpretation, the Japanese only really started to treat kinbaku as something like a dō pretty recently. In the first place, real Japanese kinbaku is something more like seme–e, for example opening a pussy with a cigarette or opening the legs wide, etc. However, what gaijin see, feel and learn is kinbaku–dō. Principally, the teaching of shibari techniques only started pretty recently. You know, kinbaku used to be done in a standing position. Firstly, hojō to capture criminals. Tied up, then for sex. It was only recently when it became kinbaku–dō; about 15 to 20 years ago. So there is absolutely no history at all. We all know about it, but since the gaijin are attracted to kinbaku–dō, Japanese are now also heading in this direction.
[Shosa (所作) conduct/behaviour], [Seme–e (責め絵) blame picture], [Hojō (捕縄) policeman’s rope]
Bingo: Well, definitely some people would object to what Ouji just said, saying that it’s wrong. In both Japan and overseas, some people say that mind and spirit are important, but then why both sexes?
Sin: Many gaijin confuse the words shibari and kinbaku, but shibari is just the physical tying without the erotic or SM. Is my understanding correct?
[Shibari (縛り) binding, tying], [Kinbaku (緊縛) bind tightly, sexual bondage]
Ouji: Nearly equal, yes. For example, in kinbaku we have spanking, SM and shibari. They overlap each other, but are not exactly the same.
Sin: So shibari is basically the technical part of tying, which is a part of kinbaku, like kotobazeme may be a part of kinbaku too?
[Kotobazeme (言葉責め) lit. verbal abuse. In context means shaming/psychological bondage]
Ouji: When we say shibari, it sounds like it’s Japanese derived, but in fact we aren’t making a distinction between shibari and binding, tying or whatever.
Sin: So shibari can be tying your hair, your shoelaces, a parcel or a lover? How do you feel about gaijin misinterpretation of Japanese words like ichinawa and ipponnawa, for example?
[Ichinawa (一縄) first rope being used. Ipponnawa (一本縄) tying with a single rope)
Ouji: I don’t teach very often, but when I teach I say that, “Nowadays it’s generally called this.” Right from the beginning, there is no real definition of what kinbaku is. It’s like talking about takatekote shibari. The original meaning of kote and gote shibari seems to have become mixed up.
[Kote (籠手 or 小手) gauntlet/cuffs/lower part of the forearms], [Gote (後手) simplified form of takatekote]
Sin: The problem I see is that gaijin readily adopt this dojo mentality. It started with Takumi Miura san about 20 years ago, then people like Steve seem to have expanded it. Steve has the advantage because he can communicate in English and German, but I see so many that don’t appear to understand the SM or the kinbaku, and this scares me a little bit. They don’t seem to understand what the reason is for tying.
Tessin: I totally agree with you.
Ouji: At the beginning of my lesson I say that you will not be able to do it as a couple when you start doing kinbaku in front of people. It’s because the original purpose of having sex will change to the purpose of doing shibari technique skillfully in front of other people.
Tessin: I have been thinking about what Ouji just said. As Sin san said just now, I’ve been thinking what is the purpose of doing kinbaku. I’m a bit of a twisted individual and I have a serious allergy to the word art, something I had since childhood. However, I’m now starting to change my mind. I was invited to Switzerland recently and they asked me to show them my shibari technique. So asked them, “What shibari do you expect? Art, porn or what?” Then about 80% of the people answered that they expected art. I felt that it meant they’d invited the wrong person, so I said so. However, I showed them my shibari as it is anyhow. Then one of them told me that, “I don’t know if the shibari you have done just now is porn or not for you, but it’s art for me. Don’t you accept it?” Well, I do accept it. If it’s art for him, that’s fine somehow.
Sin: I think of SM as a human art, but it’s an art between two people.
Tessin: Well, it’s a matter of a definition of words. For example, SM for me might be this and SM for Bingo san might be that. There also may be a different SM for Ouji. We can all have our own SM. Likewise, different people can have their own art. The man who told me that my shibari is art for him is a muscular man and has tattoos of 緊縛 (kinbaku) and 躾 (discipline) and I told him that “You’re okay. I like you.”
Ouji: Unless someone else is looking at it, we should just show it to the one we’re involved with.
Bingo: I always ask what kinbaku is for students at the beginning of my workshops both in Japan and overseas. Then I explain my kinbaku. In America, Europe, Australia and Asia, what people expect differs. As Ouji said at the beginning, Japanese kinbaku has not been established as a culture yet. So overseas as well, especially in Europe, kinbaku seems to be one like lectures at a university. So I accept it. Some people expect art, some people expect a spiritual connection and so on. Each person has their own opinion and want to master their own kinbaku. I don’t deny it. It’s also the same in Japan.
Sin: There are some people that do tsuri shibari and make it into a kind of yoga or sport bondage.
Tessin: As Ouji mentioned, many people prefer using the word dō. But, what is dō? Dō means road or path in Japanese and it is probably learning psychological matters within yourself. However, though people maybe trying to learn psychological matters, they’re learning only techniques. Teachers can only pass on techniques and this can’t be helped. However, as Bingo san and Ouji mentioned, I want each person to have their own purpose for doing kinbaku. Not just learning their teacher’s dō or spirit or ryū. To think about their purpose for doing kinbaku. If you have a thousand people tying then you should have a thousand ryū.
Sin: I see many trying to take a tie like a structure and fit it to a person and I don’t see this as particularly healthy.
All: We understand what you’re saying.
Bingo: There are many significant differences between Japan and overseas, and maybe the most significant difference is religion. You know, Christianity is a monotheistic religion. Japan has Buddhism, originally Shintoism. Thus the way of thinking differs so much. A monotheistic religion has an absolute deity, while Shinto has no absolute being. We aim for dō (road/path) instead of being obedient to an absolute god.
Ouji: There are 8 million gods in Japan.
Bingo: In fact, most Japanese people don’t really know the teachings of Buddhism and Shintoism. However, we have such environments and the way of thinking is influenced by them. It’s so difficult to explain it to most gaijin, but this is the important point in order to understand Japanese kinbaku.
Sin: For me, I think the best ‘kinbakushi’ concentrates on what the partner wants in this play. Whereas I fear in the west there’s a lot of people are kind of doing it for themselves, not for their partners, and it can be dangerous for the partner or uncomfortable and not pleasant.
Bingo: Not like in Japan.
Tessin: At least, I do only what I want to do.
Ouji: Generally, people who want to understand what the partner wants would come to learn kinbaku in Japan. On the other hand, sadistic people come to learn kinbaku to raise the level of their sadism overseas. It’s only recently that kinbaku workshops started. For example, although people want to learn how to tie ankles to a bamboo, workshops start from gote (takatekote). It’s for the teachers’ convenience to compose these workshops the way they are.
Tessin: However, there are so many elements in takatekote. So when you learn takatekote, you can apply it to other parts of the body.
Sin: These two guys (Ouji and Tessin san) are musicians. I’m a musician as well. I’ve been performing on stage for 38 years. Is Bingo san a musician?
Bingo: Oh yes, I’m a musician. Girls are my musical instrument. I make girls sound (when I play them). *Laughs*
Sin: Do you think that being musicians helps you to also perform kinbaku?
Ouji: People who can do something in front of an audience can do something to a person. So people who can speak in front of an audience can speak one to one. People who cannot speak in front of an audience cannot speak one to one either. No more and no less. So then he’s an affirmative and positive man.
Sin: Actually, when I perform kinbaku I don’t even see audience. I forget them. I only see her, the lady I’m tying.
Ouji: Ah, that’s true, but some people see only the audience.
Bingo: Ouji is acting very cool, or in another word, very shy. So he sometimes uses bad words on purpose. So if you translate it directly, he might be misunderstood. He prefers to be misunderstood, welcoming that we couldn’t understand what he really wants to say.
Ouji: From the start, there’s no such thing as kinbaku–dō. Actually I’m shy at heart. I have no problem doing something in front of an audience, but I basically tell a lie in front of an audience.
Tessin: You might be misunderstood again.
Ouji: You should post Bingo chan’s words in big letters.
[Chan (ちゃん) suffix for familiar person, as opposed to san]
Bingo: Why?
Tessin: Bingo chan is the best at telling a lie by choosing only pleasant words.
*Everyone laughs*
Sin: Social media more often than not dictates you need some form of nickname or title. Sin is difficult because it’s always taken or too short. Because it’s so awkward to describe to somebody who has no idea what I do I sometimes just say I’m a bakushi to differentiate myself where I see absolutely zero erotic in the term rigger. Do you use words like nawashi, kinbakushi, bakushi, or how do you describe yourselves?
Bingo: I don’t want to be called a kinbakushi. I prefer only my name.
Ugo: But what if other than your name?
Ouji: Well, in fact on my business card it says Rope Artist. It doesn’t mean a painter type of artist, just an artist of rope.
Bingo: People can call us any way they want. But when I describe myself I say a person handling rope. People don’t call me this. I’m just saying it myself.
Tessin: I’ve been calling myself hitodenashi for more than ten years, but I don’t mean brutal BDSM. I’ve been calling myself just a sadist, but recently I realised that I’m not just a sadist. I realised that I’m an embarrassing guy who only wants to pretend to be a master. People call us what they want and I accept it. I sometimes feel uncomfortable about it, but I’m not that bothered.
[Hitodenashi (ひとでなし) jerk, beast, wretch, etc.]
Bingo: I’m sometimes upset when people call themselves bakushi or kinbakushi.
Tessin: I don’t feel upset at all. When people call me a nawashi then I understand they want me to act as a nawashi.
Bingo: I wonder if I’m not as smart as these two.
Sin: So, what is a nawashi?
Tessin: I think nawashi describes a person who dominates the other by mainly using rope. This is a borrowed theory from Ouji; using rope with domination.
Sin: Like Naka san?
Tessin: Well, yes, maybe close to Naka san.
Sin: Ok, and the word shibarista. I heard Aotsuki san say it. Is it a complement or an insult?
Tessin: He’s from Kyoto, so he‘s probably trying to be cool.
Ugo: It’s not bad meaning, is it?
Sin: Is it kind of more like a Kansai way?
Tessin: Maybe a trying to look cool way.
Bingo: When gaijin try to get to know about kinbaku, they only have pictures and writing. They have no chance of seeing kinbaku live. However, they’re full of lies. They’re only words. Even people who don’t have the natural inclination or ability offer such words and some people may be swayed and believe such things.
Sin: Absolutely. This is why I don’t do any photography. People also hang too much on words more than realities.
Bingo: And another big feature of Japan comparing with overseas is that our culture puts emphasis on harmony.
Sin: Well, I see here are three guys who are friends in what they do. They compete somewhat with each other, but they’re still friends. In the west I see less of this camaraderie and far more aggression, competition and negativity.
Ouji: Since I’m the oldest, I will explain. Briefly speaking, we don’t admit our kinbaku to each other and yet we don’t think that the other’s kinbaku is strange. Our styles are all different and we can do other styles easily. But, I agree, in the case of overseas maybe they regard each other as business competitors.
Tessin: Can I have a moment? It’s true all over the world that people will compete to become the majority as long as they’re in minority groups. For example, I enjoy fly–fishing which is a very minor way to go fishing and people who do fly–fishing say, “I am real” anywhere in the world. It’s the same with paintings and photography. There‘s a tendency in any world that the more minority they are, the more they say, “I am the real way of doing things, I am different from others” and try to become predominant. There are also many Japanese people saying, “I do not like him”. However, when we go back to the first topic, we don’t compete with each other because we think that there’s no such thing as Kinbaku–dō. For example, think about sex. I shouldn’t meddle in the way Ouji makes love, should I? I don’t think that the way Ouji makes love is the best and I want to do it the same way, and yet I don’t think that his sex is wrong, that he should emulate my way of making love. Probably it’s because sex is the thing that everybody has. However, when it comes to minority stuff, people start saying, “I am the one”. This might be a natural human instinct and it can’t really be helped.
Bingo: When we three went fishing together, these two fish with great enthusiasm because they like it. However, I got bored with it and they accept the way I am. No one says to me something like, “You must do this” or, “You are strange”.
Ugo: You are inspired by each other, aren’t you?
Tessin: Yes, yes, yes. I think of them as rivals. I’m the youngest so this might be impolite when I say such a thing, but we do have a rival relationship and I think they are my real friends.
Ugo: So what part inspires you?
Tessin: Well, I said I get inspired, but I’m not going to compete against Bingo san’s shibari. I can’t explain it well.
Ugo: Since you get inspired, does it means that you recognise the good in him?
Tessin: For example, Bingo san has published a book. I feel he’s doing a good job, so I should do a good job as well. It doesn’t mean that I should do the same thing. I just feel that I should do a good job as well and that’s all. I’m never jealous.
Bingo: Competition can be the same in Japan. Some people involved in kinbaku as a business are opposed to each other here too.
Tessin: Speaking about us three, it’s because we have a big boss. Here’s our eldest brother.
*Ouji bursts out laughing*
Tessin: I’m the youngest brother who’s the most inexperienced and insolent, and I say, “I am as good as you” insolently against the next brother (Bingo san). He just laughs it off and forgives me, while the eldest brother warmly watches over both of us.
Ugo: So Ero Ouji is developing you and Bingo san?
Ouji: No, no, not at all! Absolutely not! I’m just a normal man and it’s only because Japanese culture respects the eldest.
Bingo: But, we are very influenced by Ouji. For example, everyone, even gaijin are untying nowadays at a very slow speed and it’s Ouji who started to untie the rope so slowly. Nobody did such thing before. Previously, many people would say, “Untie as soon as you have finished the shibari” or, “Always think of how to untie when you are tying” or, “This shibari seems complicated, but how many minutes do you need to untie it?” and so on. Many people said that arms will get numb if you take 5 minutes or 10 minutes to untie. However, untying is one of the best parts. Rope bottoms can come back so slowly and you can have an intimate relationship during it. It’s also a great physical sensation, so you mustn’t miss it. Ouji is the one who brought this up and now people all over the world are influenced by him.
Sin: Well, I certainly am.
Ouji: We can say any contrary opinions to each other. However, when it comes to techniques of kinbaku, I’ll behave with modesty and respect of another’s feelings.
Bingo: I want him to tell me everything. Ouji treats every man as a fully grown man even if he is older or younger. So his stance is that a man should clean up one’s mess and Ouji will not voice an objection to what other people are doing. So he speaks honorifically, addressing people with san after their names even if they are younger than him.
Ugo: So you are getting inspired by the activity of this group?
Bingo: We aren’t a group, though. *Laughs*
Ugo: Inspiring each other?
Bingo: Yeah, we do.
Tessin: I believe we are very much respecting each other.
Ouji: We meet each other everyday. We have more friends, but this relationship might be very rare. We aren’t in a mentoring relationship and we are apart in age. Say, we are on a different wavelength, but we hit it off. Do you see?
*Everyone bursts out laughing*
Ouji: I don’t have my own style. However, one thing that I have been doing for a long time is that I don’t do what someone else is doing.
Bingo: I learned one gote style from Ouji long before. Since then, he never does that gote anymore.
Sin: Ouji always said he wouldn’t teach. All those years ago I asked him to teach me, but now he teaches. So, why did you start to teach?
Ouji: That’s a simple story. Otonawa san started to teach at Jack Rose (Fetish Club Bar, Ginza). But, since he became the manager of Titty Twister (SM & Fetish Bar, Shinjuku) he had to leave Jack Rose. A manager of Jack Rose is a friend of mine, so he asked me to teach until he can find someone who can take over. I don’t want to teach, but I’m doing it until he can find a new teacher.
Sin: I prefer to play with the ladies than to teach.
Tessin: I think it depends on whether he teaches as a business or as a volunteer. It’s different.
Sin: Is it better to teach one–to–one than to teach workshops?
Tessin: Forgive me for saying it like this, but I feel that people who are going to start kinbaku do have enough determination. For example, everyone knows that we need 300,000 yen (USD$2,600) to get a driving license. However, no one is going to learn shibari with ¥300,000. We do need decent money eventually though. I think I’m now doing it for almost nothing, but then there would be not very much contentment. No one thinks that you can play Chopin the day you start to learn the piano. But, when it comes to shibari so many people say that, “I never thought that this would be so difficult. Maybe this is not for me”. Then I feel that, “Did you think that you could really do it so easily?”
Sin: Some people can learn mechanical things like making LEGO and then they think that they can do ropes. But, to make the lady wet from what you’re doing, that’s a special understanding.
Tessin: For example, Bingo san and I do private lessons. When someone asks me if a one–to–one lesson is available, I tell him how much it will cost and then many will ask, “How many times it will take for me to master it?” Can you answer a question like that? For example, some people learn the piano for ten years (and still can’t play). My answer is that I haven’t completed the gote shibari myself yet. I’m going to teach you what I haven’t completed, so I cannot tell you how many times it will take for you to master it. It’s until you satisfy yourself. This is how I answer.
Ouji: Well, whether in Japan or not, when there’s a workshop teaching gote, tying legs and then suspension, people learn it and that’s all. But, even if they could do it, then what can they do? Tie up a girl in a gote, suspend her and now what are they going to do with her?
Tessin: To be honest, many people just want to make the form. Then shibari will be boring and they’ll get tired of it easily. The most popular scene in a nawakai is tie her up, suspend her, put her down and finish. You’ll get tired of it when you do it three times. However, this is not the interesting part.
[Nawakai (縄会) rope meeting/gathering/party]
Ouji: You can’t teach that. In fact, all kinds of kinbaku techniques are included in one gote. So if you can do gote, you can also tie legs and anywhere else. But, what we can tell is something like, “Do it here like this and this, then fasten here.” One might be able to do a suspension in any form, but we cannot tell them the process to reach it. That might be in their character.
Tessin: Then it comes back to the topic of the purpose of doing shibari. But, we can’t teach it. It’s not a thing to be taught. It depends on each person. So we want each person to have their purpose of doing shibari, but we can’t explain it. This is what I and probably Bingo san are finding difficult and it makes us feel frustrated. One can’t have the purpose even if we tell them to do so.
Ouji: Bingo chan is trying very hard (in lessons) to explain it from the beginning, but most people don’t really understand it.
Tessin: I bought a single–lens reflex camera recently. No one reads an instruction manual through from the beginning. No one can understand it all unless they use it for a while. When I read the manual again a year later, then I can understand more. The same goes for kinbaku. It’s important to explain it all at the beginning, but people probably can’t understand even half of it. However, when doing shibari later on, they might remember some of it. Then it will do. I believe Bingo san thinks so. Don’t you?
Bingo: Not so many people try to learn rope due to their sexual predilections. Such people already do it as they like it personally. Most people don’t know if they are interested or not. However, they become aware of their tendencies while learning rope. Even Tessin san wasn’t interested in rope at all at the beginning. He was saying, “Why rope?” and, “Why do you do shibari?” and now he talks about rope passionately.
Tessin: I’m not talking about rope passionately.
Bingo: Well, now you are teaching. Many people change gradually.
Tessin: One’s interest changes. As I have already said, I couldn’t understand why men should learn and practice shibari persisting to give a girl pleasure. But, I found it interesting when I start doing it and it made me devote myself to it. The same as Bingo san. He used to show a belittling attitude to me when I was punching and kicking a girl, but now he’s just as sadistic.
Bingo: One’s interest changes very often and that isn’t such a bad thing. Sometimes people say something like, “He was just a womaniser” or, “He used to be a sub”. But, who cares? What he’s interested in now is his reality.
Ugo: The three of you are people who enjoy BDSM, aren’t you?
Bingo: Yes.
Ugo: Not only kinbaku?
Bingo: I enjoy sex.
*Everyone laughs*
Ouji: I make girls enjoy.
*Everyone laughs*
Tessin: Yeah, that’s mostly true.
Ouji: This is absolutely the purpose of kinbaku.
Bingo: Well, maybe me too. I enjoy girls.
Ouji: So I say you should have sex with every man, tied up by every man and then finally come to me.
Bingo: Nevermind if you aren’t the last one.
Ouji: I don’t mind even if she’s on the way (to orgasm).
Bingo: However, what makes Ouji special is that he can enjoy not only women but also men.
Ouji: What? No, he’s lying! Don’t write such a lie!
Bingo: I mean, transsexual, or shemale.
Ouji: No!
Bingo: If he can think of him as a woman.
Ouji: No, no, no!
Tessin: Not enjoying, but respecting her gender.
Ouji: Exactly!
*Everybody laughs*
Sin: I heard that when Bingo san was trying to explain shosa in Copenhagen, Denmark, people were looking at their cellphones and ignoring the lesson. How did Bingo san feel about that?
Bingo: Ah, Kanna san told me that I was too talkative. People who get bored are the people who don’t want to understand it. However, this is my style.
Sin: That’s very sad for everybody.
Bingo: Only Paris seems to accepts it now.
Ouji: French people try to learn the inner parts. Not so much in Italy and Spain.
*Everyone laughs*
Ouji: Anyway, I want gaijin to learn from people who are doing kinbaku regularly. I mean, many people aren’t doing it that regularly and just doing it for performance shows and practicing for teaching. Unless you learn from a person who does it with girls regularly you will never understand real shosa. It will be something like only patiently learning rope patterns. Whether they are doing it as a business, or whether it is their interest, many people aren’t doing kinbaku and just do sex in their personal lives.
Sin: I can’t submit. I’m not a switcher. I’m only dominant. How do you feel about this whole sensei–deshi thing that gaijin seem to love?
Bingo: When speaking about sadism and masochism, people have multifaceted natures. As for me, I’m a sadist, but I don’t develop a feeling of sadism toward Ouji and have no problem with this. So I think there’s no problem at all for a sadist to take someone as their teacher. There’s no need to be a solitary primacy. It’s not anything to be a teacher and a student, and we are not taught, but we’re copying. There used to be no workshops, so everyone used to look, copy and use it. I progressed in this way.
Ugo: Don’t you have someone who you consider as your teacher?
Tessin: I don’t have, no.
Ouji: Well, that’s a traditional Japanese style of lectures. So when learning Japanese things, there should be a difference related to the position of teacher and student even if you are outside of Japan. A student should never use casual language to a teacher unless learning Japanese culture in class.
Sin: Some individuals in the west can be aggressively negative toward anything that’s not Osada ryū. I have been regularly attacked.
Tessin: This brings us back to the topic of minorities. Inferior imitations appeared after Steve became the mainstream whether one likes it or not. For example, we have Kyokushin Karate in Japan, then we have many imitations such as Ashihara Kaikan and Seidou Kaikan. That’s just normal. The same thing happens in the world of art. People choose only one form which they think is correct, but they just come and go. There’s always the mainstream, but some people don’t belong to it. But, if people can’t accept alternatives to it, such culture won’t remain and I think it should collapse. As I’ve said many times, one shouldn’t boast about being a majority in a minority group. I’m not saying that you shouldn’t be one of a majority group. However, it feels really unpleasant when I see people proclaiming superiority in a minority group.
Sin: Who is the minority in this case? I’m the minority?
*Everyone laughs*
Sin: Yeah, I suppose that I am the minority in the west.
Ouji: But, in the first place something great called kinbaku spread abroad from Japan, no more and no less. There used to be no need to bind with rope though. Even in Japan, kinbaku is only that. When time changes we might be the mainstream. Even in Japan, many people thought that kinbaku is disgusting until recently. However, many people say that doing rope is cool nowadays, but this might turn around again, so there’s no need to worry about minority or majority, but when someone launches a direct attack on you that’s terrible.
Sin: Unfortunately, some people can be very zealous.
Ouji: Well, if an English speaking Japanese was to go overseas and show kinbaku, they’ll be the majority and that’s it.
Sin: I notice how people like Yoi Yoshida san and Nagare Aotsuki san are much more influential within Japan.
Ouji: Yes, they are, and they are in Tokyo and Osaka. I mean, if Aotsuki san’s place and Yoi san’s place were in the same neighborhood it might not be the same. It might have been either then.
Sin: Aotsuki san has always encouraged me. Anyway, is there anything that you want to add?
Bingo: Well, what I want to say to people from all over the world is that kinbaku accidents have became a hot topic recently and please don’t forget that we are going to play a swordfight with a drawn sword. If someone says that, “Do as I say then you won’t cause any accidents” please be very careful.
Sin: This is what scares me about teaching, because then I would feel responsible if somebody else might make a mistake.
Bingo: If an instructor of a driving school says, “Do as I say then you won’t cause an accident” it is ridiculous. So an instructor has to tell their students to take extreme care. But, even still, accidents will happen. For this reason we need to take extreme care. What else? Ah! Let’s do shibari! No need to chop logic, just do it as much as possible.
Ouji: That’s true. Don’t let your girl sit bored at a hotel. Take her to do shibari.
Bingo: That’s true. We don’t say something like, “Now let’s do shibari.”
Ouji: Whipping, cutting or whatever you like, the scars will remain. However, (even if kinbaku doesn’t leave scars), please don’t think that it’s safe. Nevertheless, please don’t think that tokonawa is safer.
[Tokonawa (床縄) tying in bed/on futon]
Bingo: Some people say that it is safe because it’s not a suspension and this scares me.
Sin: Okay. Thank you very much. This was fun.
Tessin: Yes, I’m having a really great time. It’s fun for me to be with you. Since this is my first time to talk with Sin san like this, I’m really enjoying it.
Sin: I get the girls. Huh, Ouji? *Laughs*
Ouji: Please say that money talks more. *Laughs* Money can solve anything. *Laughs* So, please write down that let’s earn money before doing rope. *Laughs*
